SBC ID III vs AVC-R

[Col-GTSX]

I thought i should post up my personal results...

Yesterday i finally got my SBC ID III and installed it along with a heap of other stuff. 11 hours later i have a riced up, speced up and bloody fast machine.

OK, my last skyline i decided to install an Apexi AVC-R. Nice unit, however i should point out a few pro's and con's.

Firstlly the AVC-R was harder to install, it has a larger wiring harness to connect up. But it ran a wire to the boost sensor which was much easier. The SBC ID III has a simple 2 wire harness and does not need constant 12+ as it has a CMOS chip to save your settings. Which is great if you unplug the battery, also good as it does not draw any current when the car is off. So as for installation i would have to say the SBC was better.

Now their installed, how to set them. Well id have to say the SBC reads in PSI/BAR/kgm2 & something else (not important) where as the AVC-R only reads and programs in kgm2. With the AVC-R you dial a boost setting and say you aim for 10psi you do the conversion anyway it does not reach the target unless you up the duty cycle. But by increasing the duty you can get boost spiking issues. With the AVC-R's learning mode it will take the car about 30 foot flat runs to reduce the spiking to almost nil. However all settings over 12psi were still spiking in learn mode. So i switch to manual, this setting has no chance of spiking, but you have to get the settings spot on. I tried to get 10psi, set to .85kg with 65% duty and you get 9.5psi up the kg to .95 and i still get 9.5psi. Now set to .85kg and up duty to 66% one more percent from original setting now you get 10.7psi. Anyway all in all takes ages to get your settings right. Also the AVC-R has 2 program modes then off so you can have as i had a dry setting and a wet setting. Its speed and gear change learning modes are crap and you would blow your motor before it learnt the speeds and gears. Now as for the SBC, it firstlly has 4 program modes plus complete auto and off. You can change the boost setting within the graph mode, dont have to go back through the menus to change the setting. Secondlly it is far more accurate. It reads peak to 2 decimal places if nessary. I am most comfortable in dialing in PSI. So the first run i dialed 10psi. Now the duty on this module was set to 35%. Anyways first time i put my foot down it launched and spun the wheels through 1st gear (255 tyres) but it hit 10psi on the nose, it read 9.9psi. So i thought id try 12psi, second run 12psi hit right on the head with absolutlly no hint of spiking. I upped the duty cycle to 50% while rolling on the highway, then flatened it in 5th at 100kph, huge responce on a high flow standard turbo. Slowed down to 80kph and droped it to 3rd gear and nailed it and almost lost the back end. It was like taking a hit up the arse. The boost came on like lightning and pushed the car up to 100kph in no time. So as for use of the unit the SBC is so much better than an AVC-R, basicilly due to its dual solinoid design and very fast processing modual.

Now for the design of the visual controler. Firstlly i have to say the AVC-R takes the cake. Its screen size is awsome, the gadge display or graph or digital allows you to watch up to 4 chanels at the same time. The SBC's screen is very small almost too small. And it will only allow you to watch on graph at a time.

I believe the dial type interface on the SBC makes it easier to change while driving and allows you to change settings while active (you dont have to exit graph mode to go back through the menus to change the boost, or you could change channel 1,2,3,4 easilly too.

As for the packaging of the product. Well i have to say i am very pi$$ed off with BLITZ because there are only Jap instructions in the box no english. I have to search all over the net to get the installation manual in english. But the vac hosing they supply with the unit is blue silicon and looks so sweet.

Overall (out of 5 stars)

Bleed valve 1

AVC-R 3.5

SBC ID III 5

Have to say after using both boost controlers id never go back to an AVC-R.

Value for money is there but quality is not, compaired to the SBC.

I really liked the AVC-R and would swear by it as a great boost controller and i would have rated it as 5 star yesterday but now i have found the SBC kicks it to the gutter.

Thanks Col

[cameron]

Interesting point,

Avc-r's are good if you set them up properly, but its alot of muking around as you mentioned to try and get it too learn. For the spiking problem - Start Duty is used in each gear to stop this.

Jun

[rd-runr]

I agree Col, SBC-ID III is unbelievably accurate. I know what you mean about the display too. Couldn't get over how small it actually was. But now I'm used to it, so its not so bad.

[Col-GTSX]

I have to say after another day of driving this boost controller is ubelievable...

You can record a session and it will remain in memory until u delete it.....

My only quarm is that the screen is a little small in comparison and the instructions took ages to track down in english. I had to subscribe to a WRX forum to download the english manual.... Otherwise its supplier at $15 AUD tho BLITZ US.... Rip off....

[Maxx]

Had a SBC ID III in my S15 as it come with it.

Previously i installed a Greddy E-01 in my R33 and i thought it was good. But compare to Blitz it's very bad.

Blitz bring the boost a lot better, feels like stock while the greddy is more like a on/ off switch even i had play around with the RPM setting and gain

I think the e-01 is equal to the top of the range profec A, as both of them has fuzzy logic while other (profec B, S) don't.

highly recommend blitz EBC

[C yar]

what is the price difference between the two?

[Col-GTSX]

AVC-R RRP $899

Blitz ID III is RRP $999

Recent group buys have seen AVC-R's under 600 buck-a-roonies...

However if you paid full price for a ID III you would be much happier. Id confidentlly say its "worth" twice as much.... It put a way bigger smile on my face...

[NEWKON.Biz]

Edited: keep it for the classifieds thanks

[Col-GTSX]

yeah i was just stating that there is very little difference in price just that it is "worth" twice as much as it does a heaps better job....

It does not matter how much u pay for it...

It does matter if it is worth what you paid...

[Nismo32R]

hmm.....just wondering how does it compare with the EVC4....i'm using ACVR at moment...but a bit pissed with the spike thing....therefore, i'm thinking of replacing it with either EVC4 or Blitz D1 limited boost controller (i think it is the same as SBC ID III)

[Col-GTSX]

Yeah i got the D1 spec.... its just a SBC ID III in black/white or silver...

Other than that its the same....

But yeah i have installed a EVC4 before but never got to test the car. But the guy was happy.... I can say with confidence that the ID III is the easiest to install and with dual valve solidoid has to make it the most accurate...

Also foot note: I played with it some more this morning. Changed it over from auto to manual. In this mode you have to use a scale of 1-100 to set the boost... bit of a poke in the dark to set the boost in manual mode but even more accurate. I recorded a one minute segment of boosting on the may home and it hit 10psi on the dot every time with not even 0.1 worth of creep..... Absolutlly fantastic boost controler....

[twoquik]

col what do you have your gain setting on? i have the ID3 also but never came with instuctions, i have mine on something like 12. can you explain wat i should put mine on.

i think you said you had yours on 50. can you explain wat the gain setting does.

Ben

[rd-runr]

twoquik,

this link is for the english version of the manual for the sbc id, which is the same as the idIII:

http://www.team3s.com/Blitz%20SBC%20i-D%20manual.pdf

should answer your Q's!

[rd-runr]

For any1 thats interested,

this link is for comparisons of some electronis boost controllers:

http://www.sportcompactcarweb.com/tech/020...c_boostcontrol/

good read!

[twoquik]

it says use a gain setting between 5-15 for stock turbocharged cars, is this what you are running col? just curious.

[Roy]

How have you guys got the AVCRs wired, ie what did you connect the purple wire to?

It strikes me as strange the trouble ppl have with setting up the AVCR. My thing is no trouble at all. Std wastegate pressure is 8psi. I have setting A to hold a rock solid, non spiking 14psi, and setting B for a rock solid 17psi. (LOL...soon to be 19psi:))

So thats over 11psi more then std spring pressure and it has no problem.:confused: as for the duty cycle, it has only ever taken me 3-4 hits to get the thing on the money and the self learning is on the job ironing out the detail. And thats with both the std turbo and the Trust jobbie i now run

Not saying the AVCR is better, but i havent found it to be near as troublesome/problematic as those posting. Based on ppls experiences it would seem that it is about the only boost controller that has been able to bump boost pressure 11psi higher then the wastegate pressure without running into boost fall off/spikes etc .

Interesting to hear your feedback on the SBC. I had a fire and just had to re-wire my loom, AVCR and Data Logger. If the fire damaged the solenoid or Map sensor i may be looking for a new EBC, but based on my experience i wouldnt have any trouble going for another AVCR.

I thought it was actually very easy to install. I think it was 6 wires to the ECU and then you can monitor all the rice like injector duty, throttle position etc etc.

Does the SBC monitor things like injector duty cycle, throttle position, have boost scramble????

When i get a minute ill post up some more questions on the SBC. If i need a new EBC i want to be sure im get the latest and greatest:)

[Roy]

LOL...and as for bar v psi readings etc, we are in OZ so its bar, 0-400mtrs, N.m etc ...not psi, 1/4 mile and ft.lbs

[Cubes]

Roy,

I used to run the Blitz SBC-iD (first one).

It was very good and held boost without tappering off.

BUT say I was to head up a hill with a constant load with boost, put my foot down boost would tend to spike in Auto Mode. This may have been fixed within with 2 revisions. (mine was rev 1)

I fiddled with the gain and found a higher gain than 40, boost would waver up and down by .5psi.

You can buy the second Power-iD that monitors all the duty cycles etc. It also gives an estimated poweroutput, 0-400m (just for you Roy) , 0-100km/h etc.

I found to get the absolute best boost response I setup 2 channels.

One manual mode which was pointed to by the scramble mode (for 1-2secs after it saw positive manifold pressure) then the other which was in auto mode. After the 1-2secs it would then flick to the auto mode.

The reason for this is the manual mode would tapper off boost like the usual % of duty cycle type EBC's. So using the manual for a scramble would bring the boost up nice and hard then the auto mode would hold the preset boost to the rev cut. The auto mode with mine would tend to bring boost on softish and boost a little less in first gear i.e not reach peak boost.

BUT it definitely sounds like they have improved with the new versions.

It used to take mine a good 2-3 flat foot runs through first,second and third to get it to the set boost I wanted.

Oh.. Also.. If you get the PowerID, it allows you to use rpm based boost.

Only down side is the scramble isn't like the usual push a button and have scramble. Its more of a preset thing that you have come on when the ebc first sees positive manifold pressure. You set the duration scramble stays on for. This was with my older version so maybe the new version is different?

[Col-GTSX]

I have done over 20 AVC-R installs and most had spiking issues... Most people make the mistake of using more than 2-3 feet of vac hose which causes a delay and can take the avc-r a bit to iron out. Other than that it never worked perfectlly over 12psi... Could not work it out.... Some cars it worked very well... Some it just didnt work at all....

Most have something to do with different spring compressions on different cars....

As for the settings. I now am using a gain of 10 in manualmode with boost set to 42... This gives me a perfect 10psi.... The gain basiclly sets how fast the car gets on boost... 0 will take days 100 will fry the tyres in seconds then the motor.... Any settings over 30 on a stock wastegate will cause spiking.... So gain is like a responce setting basiclly....

As for the extra readings yes you need the power meter to add on... It links either via another plug into the central cumputer or if sitting next to it, it will connect via IR...

The power meter will add all these extra features and more than the avc-r offers.

I will get a power id after i do a few more things. I see no need for it ATM....

To re-confirm i am now using the ID III in manual mode. Have not played with scrable as yet as im just happy to hit 10psi flat.... As for this mornings weather i had to turn it off and run stock boost as the roads were to wet... (Almost made a massive arse out of my self when i did a u-turn outside work)

[Cubes]

What are the differences between the PowerFC's built-in EBC & the AVCR?

I do remember Steve with his 3037 320rwkw R33 having no problems holding 22psi with the PowerFC's builtin EBC.

If it works well I will go with the PowerFC's built in EBC, if not I will definitely go with the Blitz again.

It did work well and was easy to use as a set and forget type ebc.. Not that I am a set and forget type of person. I'm a damn fiddler.

Col-GTSX,

Its a pitty you are not running upwards of 16psi or so. I would be very interested to see if Blitz have ironed out the spike issue in Auto mode when punching it after a constant load up hill.