Hypergear Turbochargers and High flow Services Development thread

[Manuel Kasko]

In regards to the coolers Ive been using a jjr return flow one on my 300kw e85 tune and ive never had heat soak issues on the dyno back to back runs will pull same power consistently only time Ive experienced heat soak was when drifting continously for 20min or longer on a 39 degree day.

Guessing you won't notice heat soak as much because your running e85 so it's not as prone

[dori34]

In regards to the coolers Ive been using a jjr return flow one on my 300kw e85 tune and ive never had heat soak issues on the dyno back to back runs will pull same power consistently only time Ive experienced heat soak was when drifting continously for 20min or longer on a 39 degree day.

what turbo are you running? (im guessing its not a hypergear right?)

i still cant see how a plazaman or blitz return flow will limit power when theyve been tested and proven on many cars. seems like it only limits on hypergear turbos.

[SargeRX8]

what turbo are you running? (im guessing its not a hypergear right?)

i still cant see how a plazaman or blitz return flow will limit power when theyve been tested and proven on many cars. seems like it only limits on hypergear turbos.

When you run a larger turbo, like physically larger housings, the turbo won't so much be affected by the cooler. The ss2 isn't very much physically larger than stock. I'm comparison a 3071 is noticeably larger.

[boostn0199]

what turbo are you running? (im guessing its not a hypergear right?)

i still cant see how a plazaman or blitz return flow will limit power when theyve been tested and proven on many cars. seems like it only limits on hypergear turbos.

Yes infact i am running a hypergear turbo the very early model tr43i from about 2.5 years ago with a .63 rear

[dori34]

Yes infact i am running a hypergear turbo the very early model tr43i from about 2.5 years ago with a .63 rear

the E85 is working its magic for you then.

have you ever had a 98 tune? if so, what did it make.

hypergears website shows a CA18DET making 292 @ 18psi and 300rwkw @ 22psi - impressive results.

[copycutter]

Yes infact i am running a hypergear turbo the very early model tr43i from about 2.5 years ago with a .63 rear

Now THAT is what I wanted to know. Similar setup to mine. Thanks boostn.

Even if it was a little hotter than a big dollar cooler, I'm sure the less det-prone nature of the e85 would help counteract any extra inlet temp anyway. May not be quite as earth shatteringly powerful as big dollar parts but it will still be quicker than it is now and won't have this annoying misfire that it does now because of the timing not being so retarded with the ethanol fuel.

Edited March 16, 2012 by copycutter

[boostn0199]

the E85 is working its magic for you then.

have you ever had a 98 tune? if so, what did it make.

hypergears website shows a CA18DET making 292 @ 18psi and 300rwkw @ 22psi - impressive results.

On 98 I made 270kw at 18psi and still never had heatsoak on the dyno.

[boostn0199]

Now THAT is what I wanted to know. Similar setup to mine. Thanks boostn.

Even if it was a little hotter than a big dollar cooler, I'm sure the less det-prone nature of the e85 would help counteract any extra inlet temp anyway. May not be quite as earth shatteringly powerful as big dollar parts but it will still be quicker than it is now and won't have this annoying misfire that it does now because of the timing not being so retarded with the ethanol fuel.

Yeah e85 definately helps and even when it does get heat soaked since your tune is so safe on e85 it doesn't cause much concern for pinging.

[copycutter]

You mind if I ask what boost and fuel pump you have?

Edit: I see you just posted boost

Edited March 16, 2012 by copycutter

[dori34]

On 98 I made 270kw at 18psi and still never had heatsoak on the dyno.

hmm interesting,so there's your setup that proves it works.

may i ask who tuned it?

would it because these new high flow range from hypergear runs hotter (issue already brought up in this thread numerous times) so they would need a better cooler setup?

surely it would be turbo related, and not cooler setup?

[Birds]

Here's a good example of a late model HG turbo, the SS2, which made all the power it's supposed to with the right mods:

http://www.skylinesaustralia.com/forums/topic/55845-rb25-turbo-upgrade-all-dyno-results/page__view__findpost__p__6063933

Very responsive for the power output. Note the front mount and external gate setup - it was also tuned at the same place that Stao uses for his test vehicle.

[GTScotT]

Now THAT is what I wanted to know. Similar setup to mine. Thanks boostn.

Even if it was a little hotter than a big dollar cooler, I'm sure the less det-prone nature of the e85 would help counteract any extra inlet temp anyway. May not be quite as earth shatteringly powerful as big dollar parts but it will still be quicker than it is now and won't have this annoying misfire that it does now because of the timing not being so retarded with the ethanol fuel.

Bandaid's are good when your a child, seeing something cover the wound makes you feel better like its not even there but the truth of the matter is the bandaid aint fixing sh*t.

In your case E85 would be a bandaid. Your not making the right power on 98, so why try mask it with E85? First fix your 98 problem then consider do you want more from 98? I would not expect a G3 to do sub 270kw, otherwise somethings up.

[copycutter]

Bandaid's are good when your a child, seeing something cover the wound makes you feel better like its not even there but the truth of the matter is the bandaid aint fixing sh*t.

In your case E85 would be a bandaid. Your not making the right power on 98, so why try mask it with E85? First fix your 98 problem then consider do you want more from 98? I would not expect a G3 to do sub 270kw, otherwise somethings up.

I get where you're coming from, but from my point of view it's all a matter of cost now having spent what I have up until now.

If I were to change intercoolers, I wouldn't want to buy another cheaper-range one and risk the same outcome even if it were the "not turnflow" type. To buy an intercooler that is more top shelf would cost closer to $1000. And then of course there is the obligatory retune and finger crossing.

Whereas I could just make the engine more resistant to knock and allow timing to be added by just adding a nismo pump, selling my walbro one and retuning. This is the method that my tuner recommended despite me asking if he thought the intercooler was up to the task or not. By resisting knock I get my peace of mind, and by adding timing I can avoid forcing the standard coil packs to work hard to fire and create misfire as I have now.

I would think he is in a pretty good position to comment on what he thinks I should add to the setup for best results (vs cost), having spent the time tuning the current setup that he has.

[paulr33]

id be very surprised changing intercoolers would fix your problem

the only time i would agree with that statement is if you had the stock SMIC and it basically achieved 0% intercooler efficiency

the more boost you dial in, the hotter the intake charge

thats simple physics and you cant avoid that

sure there are better and worse intercoolers

if your intercooler is working and the intake temp is half normal one side is hot, one side is stone cold

if your intercooler is not working and the intake temp is spastic both sides are hot

im just not convinced going to another intercooler is going to magically solve the second issue (if you have that problem)

[GTScotT]

If your running out of fuel, then you should change your pump. Changing the pump wont make it more ping resistant unless your literally running lean, that should have been discussed earlier if its the case as I dont even know why your going there now.

Is it not possible for you to get the tuner on side and get some extra dyno time to have this sorted without paying through the nose? If so you can then BORROW a cooler from another member and whack it on to see if it makes a difference. Dont lop up your bar or anything, leave it off. Etc Etc Etc.

That dump definitely has to go through.

Its really not going to take much time to strap the car on the dyno and add some timing before saying, nup not fixed or yep this worked lets keep tuning. Have a chat to the tuner. Otherwise yeah take his advise alone, he knows best.

[copycutter]

If your running out of fuel, then you should change your pump. Changing the pump wont make it more ping resistant unless your literally running lean, that should have been discussed earlier if its the case as I dont even know why your going there now.

Sorry, didnt explain myself on this one clearly enough. The car has plenty of fuel on 98 ron with the Walbro 255lph pump. My tuner said that if I want to change to e85, then the Walbro won't do it, and his suggestion was Nismo. Further reading on this forum seems to back that up. So if I wanna change fuels, change pumps too.

Is it not possible for you to get the tuner on side and get some extra dyno time to have this sorted without paying through the nose? If so you can then BORROW a cooler from another member and whack it on to see if it makes a difference. Dont lop up your bar or anything, leave it off. Etc Etc Etc.

I suppose I could try and get goodwill tuning, but if I were him running a business, I wouldn't expect to have to retune because a setup was poor, which Is more on the car owner for lack of research I guess. As for borrowing parts from forum members, I don't know anyone on the forum at a personal enough level to borrow a cooler and leave them stranded while I sort out my own issues

That dump definitely has to go through.

Yep, not disagreeing with the HG thread logic on this one, just too bad I ended up buying a split one in the 1st place.

Its really not going to take much time to strap the car on the dyno and add some timing before saying, nup not fixed or yep this worked lets keep tuning. Have a chat to the tuner. Otherwise yeah take his advise alone, he knows best.

I'll definitely have a talk to him about it anyway as I work towards the other parts I need now, and who's to say he may help me out, I'm just not expecting him to.

I appreciate the advice though and not knocking any of it, you probably are quite right about what's missing now. I realise you're trying to help me get the best out of the setup I have.

[boostn0199]

Bandaid's are good when your a child, seeing something cover the wound makes you feel better like its not even there but the truth of the matter is the bandaid aint fixing sh*t.

In your case E85 would be a bandaid. Your not making the right power on 98, so why try mask it with E85? First fix your 98 problem then consider do you want more from 98? I would not expect a G3 to do sub 270kw, otherwise somethings up.

Did you even read my post? I am not running a atr43 G3, Im running the ancient hypergear turbo tr43i which the power is spot on to what stao predicted it would make at the time when I bought it. I was told to expect 260-270 mark on 98 so I have not bandaid fixed anything since I never had a heat soak problem from the beginning as continous runs on dyno whether 98 or e85 I didnt get massive power drops.

[75coupe]

if you need to spend $400 on a nismo fuel pump togo to E85, why not buy a decent FMIC, Greddy ones at only $600 with full piping kit, less how much you sell the current one for... then you know you have something decent... $1000 on a FMIC is overkill for your power level and parts being used, like your using a HG turbo your not exactly putting top shelf parts on, decent parts yes, but $1K on a FMIC for your setup aint needed...

fix the issue, then when you go further in the future you atleast have a solid base

[Hanaldo]

Definitely talk to your tuner about it, with my previous HG turbo my first tuner was very willing to help me out and would only charge me $100 per session for dyno time. It's just unfortunate that it didn't work out and I ended up going to another tuner; although looking back the improvement in power is probably because of the change of dyno not the tuner.

[boostn0199]

You mind if I ask what boost and fuel pump you have?

Edit: I see you just posted boost

Im running a nismo intank as my feed pump and the 044 from my surge but the results were the same when I just used the single nismo intank.

hmm interesting,so there's your setup that proves it works.

may i ask who tuned it?

would it because these new high flow range from hypergear runs hotter (issue already brought up in this thread numerous times) so they would need a better cooler setup?

surely it would be turbo related, and not cooler setup?

It was tuned at chequred tuning the same place that does staos car so results should be very comparable.