Review- Sydneykid Suspension Package- S15 200sx

[nfi]

Start off by apologising for the long post but I think it gives context. Secondly, a big thank you to Gary (sydneykid). He has been incredible to deal with and I have learnt so much along the way. He is also a great character.

I know this is a Skylines forum but there seems to be a number of people with s15's.

My car was the test dummy for the most ‘extreme’ coilover kit. Its probably best explaining my journey with my suspension to give context.

Phase 1

Bought the car with standard suspension and then fitted whiteline adjustable swaybars. 27mm front and 20mm rear. This reduced roll significantly. Turn in improved and the car felt sharper and more stable. Probably the best value for money upgrade so far.

Phase 2

Decided I would improve the suspension thinking I would finish off the primary hardware making it a nice compromise between the road and track by fitting KYB AGX shocks and Dobson springs. This lowered the car 1 inch. I then fitted a rear camber kit to correct the excessive rear camber.

The car now felt like a death trap with shocking diagonal pitching creating a car that was very nervous, difficult to drive and very very uncomfortable even though the rates were very soft (3.4kg/mm front, 2.2kg/mm rear- standard rates for lowered springs for an s15). The car now looked like it had extremely stiff springs driving behind it as it ‘chopped’ over bumps. On long drives along less than perfect mountain roads the car actually became very unpredictable and inspired absolutely no confidence. It began to ‘float’ at anything over 110km/hr round corners and all the weight of the car felt like it was in the front outside corner, ie. The car permanently felt like it want to pitch you straight forward off the road if you were going 1km/hr too fast.

My rationale at the time behind going with softer springs and normal adjustable shocks is that talking to many people they had suggested that Japanese coilovers are too stiff and make the car unpleasant to drive on a daily basis. Actually reduce the predictability of traction and overall grip on rough roads (ie Sydney roads) due to the spring rates being too stiff.

Phase 3

After hearing great reports from Skyline owners, I then approached Gary (Sydneykid) to make something very special, the other extreme if you like, putting together a top end package that was guaranteed to perform. It is worth noting I am very fussy with suspension as I have had a number of cars that all handled very well on and off the track.

Gary then discussed with me my expectations, the modifications done so far and any planned and the way I wanted the car to handle. Gary then recommended a Bilstein coilover kit but with some special high grade parts in the shocks which included the big daddy 50mm multi-orifice competition spec pistons and a 32 valve stack. Further to my fussiness I also requested that the car not be crashy and unpleasant to drive to the point where the car felt and sounds like a cheap piece of crap. Hence a 32 valve stack was put in that makes the shocks incredibly adaptable to road conditions having a wide spectrum of road surfaces it can control. To put that in context, similarly priced Tein coilvers have a 12 valve stack which is a comparatively small window of rough and smooth roads that the shock can control the spring. Hence they are adjustable so you can move the window in which they are efficient. With a 32 valve stack the adjustability is no longer required as they work across the entire spectrum from hard to soft on the Teins without sacrificing ride quality.

While putting these in I also put in front camber bolts to give me more adjustment even though I knew strut tops were coming.

With this completed the car now drove like a Euro. Even though I had near doubled the standard spring rates, the car was more comfortable but also much sharper. Gary will tell you I am very critical, hard to impress and extremely picky but these just blew me away. Only problem was that I could only get 1 degree of camber in the front. The car had a fair bit of understeer at the limit due to the lack of front camber and, in Gary’s opinion, slightly a too smaller rear bar, which is upgraded in Phase 5.

Phase 4

When it came time for strut tops we decided to wait and trial the new Noltec inverted strut tops which give the car an extra 23mm of travel which to anyone who understands the limitations of the Macpherson strut front end in the s15 will be amazed by. While these do have a spherical bearing in them, they are encased in polyurethane. This reduces the NVH (crashiness) that comes from the common pillow ball tops due to them being basically metal to metal and therefore transferring noise. They can adjust both camber and castor and unlike the old ones are easy to adjust without jacking the car up. Being precise is quite easy.

With the new strut tops, I definitely noticed an increase in NVH compared to the standard rubber tops. But nowhere near as bad as other cars I have ridden in with the usual pillow ball tops. Gary warned me that they would be a little harsher, but they were necessary to allow the camber and caster that I required. They are noticeable, but only over road joins, ie harsh, sharp bumps.

However, the car now has incredible turn in and feels very stable and composed. It now inspired confidence and was a joy to drive. When the car previously dropped all its weight like one of the biggest losers changing sides in a dinghy, it happened slowly but eventually dangerously. The transformation is amazing.

Phase 5

The car was yet to get a wheel alignment and I was waiting on the bigger rear swaybar. Once the 22mm rear bar arrived I then booked it in to have the castor bushes and new larger swaybar fitted. The reason I am not fitting rose jointed adjustable castor and camber arms is because Gary is strongly against rose jointed arms in a car that is driven on the street because they wear out so quickly and once they do they rattle which is irritating and you then get dynamic camber (changes when it wants, due to the ‘play’ in the joint) and castor which is VERY bad for the cars handling. Suffice to say I was very pleased with the alignment. With a Macpherson strut, unlike a multilink, you want as much castor as possible without rubbing the front guards. Typically, those with rose jointed arms tend to get 8.5-9 degrees castor at best but have to remove the front liners because the wheel rubs. I managed to get 9 degrees castor but did not have to remove the guards because the camber bushes pulled the arm forward and the camber tops pulled the strut back giving a substantial amount of castor without pulling the wheel too far forward. Obviously I lose a little bit of anti-dive not having the wheel as far forward but I am pleased I can keep my liners at least for the moment until the fly out and I drive over them at the track.

I can now easily adjust my camber for road and track without even jacking the car up. I just undo 3 bolts and adjust the camber to either 1, 1.75 or 2.5 degrees of camber. I like 1.75 on the street even though Gary tells me it’s too much. I was advised that I don’t need anymore than 2.5 degrees of front camber even though some would disagree because I have a stiffer rear bar which will improve turn in and reduce the compromise the additional camber will give to braking.

The car is now incredible. Turn in is incredible, at mid corner the car is now very stable and balanced and on the corner exit the car can put the power down really well.

Gary certainly gave me some insights that goes against the grain of what is typically suggested in the track community but once questioned, (I certainly asked enough of them J) he was always able to provide a rational reason why this was the case and where the misconception came from. Typically this related to type of shocks, spring rates, swaybar rates used and the alignment settings. Good suspension is a combination of the parts involved, no one part on it’s own will make a car handle well. Most of all (best of all) it is possible to have a car that handles great and yet doesn’t shake your teeth loose.

Gary told me, after my car was finished, that he was using it (and me) as a test for some S15 suspension kits that he was developing. Similar to what he did for Skylines, so anyone thinking of suspension for their S13/14/15 I strongly suggest that you look out for the Group Buy on SAU.

Will have some feedback on how it is on the track in the next month, I am really interested in finding out how much faster it is now with the new suspension kit in it.

Thanks to Gary (Sydneykid) and Exceller Steering, my car now handles and rides like I always wanted.

[salad]

Nice review. Have you thought about putting this on NS.com? I think a fair few people there would be interested in your results.

[eron]

Great review. Thanks.

[nfi]

No worries. Pleased its valuable.

[R32 GT-R]

Nice review. Have you thought about putting this on NS.com? I think a fair few people there would be interested in your results.

yeh would be interesting to see how that would go down on ns.com

[siddr20]

A great review there!!

Glad the group buy is a sucess!! now just wish i had the money to buy these parts lol..

Yup i wonder what ns.com will think of it.. They will be wondering who SK is lol..

[(B1) MR_fanny]

SK is GOD!!.......of suspension...lol

great review!

[sakobato]

I've been waiting for someone to write about this. Thanks for the effort.

[eron]

Gary told me, after my car was finished, that he was using it (and me) as a test for some S15 suspension kits that he was developing. Similar to what he did for Skylines, so anyone thinking of suspension for their S13/14/15 I strongly suggest that you look out for the Group Buy on SAU.

Will have some feedback on how it is on the track in the next month, I am really interested in finding out how much faster it is now with the new suspension kit in it.

So your car is going on the track with the new eibach + bilstein coilovers in May?

[trivial]

cool thanks for that.

Just wondering, before the cambertops what was the car like going over bad roads (with constant bumps...like old track tracks) like?

Does the car miss that much without having the camber tops?

thanks in advance

[EnricoPalazzo]

interesting info. Thanks alot

[phunky_monkey]

Thanks for the comprehensive review!

Have you tracked it as yet?

[nfi]

So your car is going on the track with the new eibach + bilstein coilovers in May?

Thats the plan work permitting.

cool thanks for that.

Just wondering, before the cambertops what was the car like going over bad roads (with constant bumps...like old track tracks) like?

Does the car miss that much without having the camber tops?

thanks in advance

Before the camber tops the car felt like the quick BMW's, mercedes- it was super quiet and the ride incredibly controlled.

With the camber tops don't get me wrong it is still just as comfortable and controlled. Its just that you get more noise coming into the cabin eg. over sharp bumps you hear it. It is not that bad. Friends of mine reckon its nothing but I am incredibly picky. The camber tops have more compliance (less noise getting into cabin) than japanese pillowball tops as they have quite a bit of urethane. Don't let my feedback on the noise put you off. Its simply an observation. Most times you drive it you won't even hear anything but if you do go over very sharp bumps you hear it.

Thanks for the comprehensive review!

Have you tracked it as yet?

Thanks! No, plan is this month at the powerplay track day, hopefully beforehand.

[nfi]

yeh would be interesting to see how that would go down on ns.com

A great review there!!

Glad the group buy is a sucess!! now just wish i had the money to buy these parts lol..

Yup i wonder what ns.com will think of it.. They will be wondering who SK is lol..

I put it up there in motorsport to hopefully reduce the amount of muppets but i'm still scared.

For those interested, my car will be at the Tech night at Heasemans in sydney in a few weeks time.

[DSR20R]

Would it be possible to go for a drive in your car as I want to purchase suspension soon and I am confused between teh Tein and the Whiteline.

[maccattack]

Nice review - very thorough - thanks

[scathing]

yeh would be interesting to see how that would go down on ns.com

He'll probably get flamed for spending so much time and money on something that doesn't blind passers-by with glare, or make the car more impressive on the dyno.

[nfi]

He'll probably get flamed for spending so much time and money on something that doesn't blind passers-by with glare, or make the car more impressive on the dyno.

http://www.nissansilvia.com/forums/index.p...howtopic=226630

I put it in the motorsport section as there seems to be less muppets... I don't think they have found it yet.

[evil_weevil]

James!!!

sounds like the car has come a long way from when I last saw it!

Great stuff - great write up!

Im half way through my suspension upgrades from Gary's GB - Ive still got front and rear camber adjusters to go (Ive just spent a fair bit on my holiday to Europe! ) so those mods will be due shortly!

Looking forward to the Heasmans night mate, see you then!

[nfi]

James!!!

sounds like the car has come a long way from when I last saw it!

Great stuff - great write up!

Im half way through my suspension upgrades from Gary's GB - Ive still got front and rear camber adjusters to go (Ive just spent a fair bit on my holiday to Europe! ) so those mods will be due shortly!

Looking forward to the Heasmans night mate, see you then!

Thanks Chris. :PBJ:

When you saw it last it had the kyb's in it. Car is seriously emptying the wallet at the moment.

See you at the heasemans night.

James