thats the whole argument... thats why it should not have the gtr emblem or be an r35... it should by rights, be a v35 gtr if anything, as its derived from the v35 skylines, or a z thing, or start a whole new family.

they couldnt make a gtst version of it.... the gtr version isnt fat enough, the guards would have to be concave in order to be skinnier than the gtr... haha.

Register on the forums for fewer ads.

+1.

I don't think Mark so much took offence at the meanderings of the thread but really at the advice Martin was offering to him. What I don't get is that Martin is an experienced tuner offering free advice on this forum when he doesn't have to. Yes of course he gets business from it but why shouldn't he? Not that I imagine he was anticipating Mark driving his GT2 over to Adelaide to be tuned by him either.

Everything single thing Martin said was true:

1. A canned tune by an "experienced" tuner is never going to be as good as a custom tune by a less experienced tuner without reducing the safety margins built in by the factory. Otherwise Porsche would have provided the same tune in the first place. Id rather a less experienced tuner tuning a car sitting in front of him than the most experienced tuner tuning something he cannot see/touch/verify. Tuning is very much all about sneaking up on an optimum figure. How many iterations did MGS's tuner go through in getting the tune right? None!!! They didn't even ask for him to send back data logs/dyno results. To me it's unfathomable that you can fly blind like this on such an precious vehicle especially when simply changing the exhaust on a car can send it's boost curve up the creek in an instant. I think Mark has been swayed or even hoodwinked by talk about people's "experience" with tuning the GT2 claiming that no-one here has done it. Ultimately it's still just a motor that can be tuned like any other. It's not alien technology. All the "experience" provides is perhaps that the tuner can get quickly get closer to the optimum tune faster because he's been there before and knows what he can dial in safely as a starting point. Ultimately the final tune is arrived at by trial and error whilst monitoring the motor's response to input changes. RS don't have a monopoly on this skill especially when they don't even want to use it...

2. Lack of effort on the tuner's behalf in minimising the inconvenience to the owner by allowing him to read the ECU in Australia and email the data file over to Germany to be tweaked to me reeks of arrogance and "couldn't be stuffed" attitude. They'd rather MGS was off the road for many weeks than just getting off their bums and communicating a simple way to get this done without removing and posting the ECU.

3. The fact they couldn't get the first tune right with the ECU in their actual possession casts massive doubt on their competence and/or care factor for this car sitting out of sight around the other side of the world.

4. And what appeared to be the straw that broke the camels back was the most salient point Martin could have raised. And that is at least verifying that the tune hasn't pushed the engine beyond any limits in AFR, knock/timing and boost. I've tuned many of my Subaru's myself and boost overshoots and ramps are so very dependent on the unique attributes of each engine and if the tuner pushed the boost ramp rates in the tune there's a very major risk that this car could very easily suffer boost spikes that a simple dyno run or logged run on the road will verify very quickly. I'd like a free service where I could do a tune myself or get a canned tune and then publish my results on here to be critically examined by an experienced tuner so I could perhaps go back and rectify a few issues/problems! It appears to be more than the German tuner was offering yet MGS took offence from it.

5. A remote tune without the ability to revert to standard when you take the car in for a service is immediately voiding your engine warranty when Porsche see its been reflashed. Hmmm whats the GT2 engine worth? $100K? Whats another ECU worth for hiding this mod? My minimum requirement would have been for me to be able to go down to my local tuner and get him to revert the ECU to standard when I took my car in for service/warranty work. My true preference would have been for me to do it using my accessport in my garage the day I drove it down to Nissan

And what's with that exhaust system!!! At least Willall's midpipes/exhausts are made on a jig and fit first time every time! Seriously how hard can it be to get it right especially when you KNOW you're shipping this piece of kit overseas to be fitted to a piece of perfection such as the GT2? I think one thing this thread has demonstrated is that these elite euro tuning houses/parts suppliers aren't necessarily better than what we're used to here in Australia.

All in all it's not the approach I would have taken with my car that's for sure. Others might disagree but what MGS went through would have left a bad taste in my mouth and I didn't detect too much of "I told you so" from anyone on this forum when they could have had a field day...

And someone said I have long posts

Well I'm of the opinion that the aftermarket tuning and parts we have here in Australia are among the best in the world, particularly in the ECU department (MoTec, Haltech).

No matter how knowledgeable Martin may be in his industry, I can see where his remarks came across as condescending or patronising for Mark...there are much better ways to offer advice than to project the arrogance (or R35 bias) that others clearly picked up on. But that is where a nice teaspoon of cement for the OP doesn't go astray...as opposed to the "screw you guys...I'm going home" aka Eric Cartman approach.

+1 fungoolies... although he did say that he had a porsche tech as a friend helping him out fitting the exhaust, and he has porsche friends in seattle (i may have made that bit up, i cant remember) etc.. and you dont know his back story... so maybe he has more porsche experience than he has mentioned..

while martin seemed to be offering free and logical advice, he came across very arrogant and seemed to be nit picking mgs's every decision.. i had a friend who did that, always asking everyone "why did you get that, why didnt you get this?? but he did it in a way that was saying "what you got is shit, your an idiot for getting it".. needless to say, hes not my friend anymore.

i think martin had the same effect on mgs.

LOL NZM I too have an ex-friend like that, who if you told that you bought a GTS-T he would immediately tell you that you should have bought a GTR. Somehow he always made the right decision when it came to buying things though

What can I say...I was bored

too much coffee can have the same effect... just you'll do it in a 1/4 of the time and not really know what you are typing.

mate this car is hot love it,
I would probably go a porsche gt2 over an r35 as well haha

Haha reminds me of the university days...funny thing is that even after being up for 32 hours straight and no longer knowing who I was anymore, I still got an HD for the lab report!!!

...everyone knows a'friend' like that..and nearly 100% of the time these people are NO WHERE.

I know I guy who has the 'the BEST XE fairmont' in Australia...and is looking to buy the 'Best VP Calais' in Australia and we should be in awe.....

Then he tells us how often he drives one of his clients Ferrari Testarossa and except he REALLY knows how to drive it.

....actually a bit like that beardo violin playing loser on Kath 'n Kim who was briefly 'Sharron's' boyfriend.

those friends are up there with the "one uppers".... the ones that no matter what youve done, theyve done it bigger and better. haha.

lol yanks?

ok, c'ya

size 3 font in all posts ftmfl.