Ok peeps in the past I've been a bit down on Israel on account of them barging in and setting themselves up about sixty years ago. Mind you there have been Jews living in the area continuously for thousands of years, but there's more of them now and they do act like paranoid loonies at times too.

On the other hand I'm starting to think the Palestinians don't need Israel to destroy them because they appear to be perfectly capable of destroying themselves.
I mean FFS now Hamas and Fatah are pretty close to civil war.
http://www.gulfnews.com/region/Middle_East/10095161.html
http://english.aljazeera.net/NR/exeres/95F...60113F99A31.htm

These guys need their heads read. They're certainly not doing the Palestinian people any favours despite all their rhetoric.
The way they're carrying on reminds me of Iraq or Afghanistan.
Fatah is notoriously corrupt and IMO Hamas are a pack of tossers. FFS they started the latest shitfight in Lebanon.
They are as responsible for the resulting death and destruction as the Iraelis are.
What the f#$k is the problem with these guys?

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try putting yourself in the boots of a Palestinians for a while:
Back in 1948 u got a farm a house u own it , overnight it not yours because your not a Jew u don`t have a country and no rights.
Hammas were a elected by the people they are a democracy. So what do Israel/USA do as they are great defender of democracy , they with hold the tax because it`s not the government they want.
The last war in Lebanon : 44 unarmed israel ppl die 119 soldiers
:1300 unarmed lebs ppl and 300odd soldiers (these number are off the top of my head)
Who is the real torrorists 44 v 1300 and israel have laser guided bombs if they are so accurate as they make out no civilians would have been hurt ( unless they targeted civilians )

I don`t know what i would be like if i grew up in Palestine but i don`t think i would be taking the abuse with good humour

Yeah I know about 1948. Like I said I've been down on Israel in the past. I'm still not all that impressed with some of their policies either.
About the money for the Hamas government though: it was only going to be witheld until Hamas officially renounced violence against Israel. If they'd done this the money would've been theirs. No problem.
And that's still no reason for Hamas and Fatah to start fighting each other when their people have enough problems already.
Yes the Israeli actions in Lebanon were way over the top but remember one thing: Hamas had a pretty good idea how the Israelis would react. They aren't naive. They knew they would be doing the Lebanese people a disservice and their backer (Iran) doesn't give a toss about the Palestinians.
In fact I doubt any of the Muslim governments really give a toss about the Palestinians because let's face it, none of them have offered the refugees a place to live.

I don`t think we can blame hamas for the last war i think if we are to blame anyone it hezbollah. They did "invade" israel to kidnap that soldier (who is still missing)
With hamas they all along believed in the destruction of israel they went to elections saying this , i know it bad but that why they won. The palestine ppl must not like israel much what are the reasons for this , would israel be better off making life in palestine better than dying , if they done this hamas wouldn`t get a look in.

Once again these numbers are off the top of my head but i think there are 3million palestinian refugee in the muslim countries around israel , there are more palestinian refugee than any other ppl in the world so in theory iraq is a better country to live in

Sorry for the slow reply im at work

F#$k you're right. It was Hezbollah. My bad. Got them and Hamas mixed up.
Anyway the Lebanon thing was definitely the Iranians shit-stirring.

I know it's different with Gaza and the West Bank coz technically they're not part of Israel, but Palestinians living in Israel get free government health care and the right to vote just like any other Israeli citizen.

You're right about Hamas getting in on a protest vote too, but it was pretty silly of them not to recognise Israel because let's face it Israel isn't going anywhere.

It was kind of both of them , israel attacked hamas in Gaza because of some reason and then hezbollah kidnap that soldier in support of hamas and then everything turned to s#$t.
My grandfather was in palestine in WW1 the palestinian fought side by side with the poms and aussies for a free homeland , israel wasn`t heard of , what happens when they get rid of the turks well thet got a worse enemy i just don`t think it fair

Hey I just Wiki'ed Hamas and those guys are seriously off the air.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hamas

A few excerpts:




From the Hamas Charter:

Rotary and Lions' Clubs are part of the Zionist invasion????


Oh FFS, that is completely nuts. There may be a few Ultra-Orthodox nutters who'd like to see that degree of expansion but the Israeli government and people in general have no such agenda.
On top of that "The Protocols of the Elders of Zion" is a load of codswallop.
It's been quoted by everyone who hates Jews since it was compiled by the Tsar's secret police in Russia at the start of the 20th century to give them an excuse for a pogrom.
Among other things it accuses the Jews of sacrificing Christian children and drinking their blood.
Note that consuming blood is contrary to kosher law, quite apart from the fact that Jews do not practice human sacrifice.
EDIT: For those who aren't familiar with the "Protocols" here's a rundown. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Protocols..._Elders_of_Zion


Seems like a constructive attitude.


That's bloody loony too.


EDIT: Oh yeah, the Wiki article says Hamas are "anti-Semitic". That term has become corrupted. ALL people from that general area, including Arabs, are Semitic.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Semitic

The easiest solution is to just nuke the whole middle east so all thats left is sand.
Well maybe not the best idea but surely the easiest.

hh

I think you're talking shit, but that's just my opinion.

I think kralster is really from Victor Habour U.S.A not S.A.
Well that would explain why he wants to nuke everything

Well yes i am talking shit.
But hell it certainly the easiest way.
I never said it was the best.

There is a doco on google, which i posted in the other thread. obviously you havnt seen it,w ith all your wisedom in ur posts. you are Unaware, and this may have some truth to it, do not be fooled into thinking for 1 minute ,they are treated like other Israeli citizens.

Like USA in history has shown their racsim, with "White only" cafes, and areas etc. this sort of thing goes on in Israel, against palistinians. Where they are treated as animals by most jews, and are not allowed in certain shops, or centers, cafes, parks, schools, and other area's, There is Signs posted " No palistine" etc, and this is all video taped for the google doco. if you just took a look.

Oh btw, That is actually true, but the name of the book is wrong. They are using these things, in vain, obviously twisting it some to try and dig up some support. Using their religion as a propaganda tactic, much the same s israel does also.

The palistinians and other affiliates and countries surrounding them, are simple people. What you need to do is look at the history documentations and documentries ive provided in the other thread i posted. Surrounding and initiating these conflicts, then how it progressed.

Simply If you look at the cold hard facts. the bottom line is israel is the problem, and should give back their land and piss off. and USA shouldnt be supporting the genicide. Or us for that matter.

Iran is intimidated and scared of USA. And they know if they officially got involved USA would step in, and use it as an excuse, probably using the properganda that "Iran is supporting terrorists".

Its funny, I saw the news and a "Terrorist was shooting at an Israeli tank" it was an 8 year old boy throwing a rock at thetank, cause they just blew his brother up, who had came outside to get his little brother inside because the tanks were comming again. and the tank then shot the 8 year old boy dead. and said he had a "assault rifle", and was "at terrorist". but the footage on CNN clearly showed the truth.

The News Article and Video footage is now missing from the archive?
Just tried to do a search to post it up, and it seems to be missing.

It's been called The Protocols of the Elders of Zion for a century now kiddo.
If you want to rename it that's your business.
As for the Arabs being simple people, first that's an insult to the intelligence of Arabs.
Second they have a history of civilisation rivalling anything in the West's history.

As for history, what makes you think I don't know anything about it?
Seriously the fact is Israel aint going away. Get used to it.
You don't have to like it but that's the way it is.

Looky mate the point I'm getting at is that bitching about the existence of the state of Israel is a bit like bitching about the presence of non-Aboriginal people in Australia.
Sure the some of the historical aspects of it suck big time but there's f#$kall we can do about that.
Saying Israelis should give all their land back and f#$k off somewhere else is like saying everyone who isn't Aboriganl should leave Australia. It aint gonna happen. Sorry.